Cali Sober? Straight Edge? ...Grey Area?

*Disclaimer: This podcast is for informational and entertainment purposes only and is not intended as medical advice; we are not licensed medical or mental health professionals.*

In this episode, we dive into different categories of sobriety, including gray area drinking, sober curiosity, mindful drinking, straight edge, Cali sober and recovery. We re-iterate the importance of self-discovery and empowerment in redefining one's relationship with substances, emphasizing that there is no one-size-fits-all approach. We touch on the cultural aspects of sobriety, including the punk roots of straight edge and the concept of Cali sober. As always, we encourage you to explore your own journeys and aim to support you the best way we can! 

If you're looking for additional support check out our resource list: 

-Nosedive Co. Sober Curious Resource: www.nosedive-co.com

-Reddit Sober Community : www.reddit.com/r/stopdrinking/

-Sober Sisters Group: www.facebook.com/groups/1465040293589777

-Relationship Centered Recovery Resource (TWFO): twfo.com/about

-Sunnyside Mindful Drinking App: www.sunnyside.co/about

-LaunchBreak: Female Athlete Network Platform : launchbreak.com

Transcript

Renee (00:01)

Hey guys, welcome back to Nose Dive here, Renee with Mara. And it's been a little minute, but yeah, we're happy to be back and really excited to talk about this topic today. And it's our first request. So I'm really excited because I think it's something that people, one, like to talk about and kind of ruminate and stew in a little bit, ⁓ maybe even a little controversial.

Mara DeMauro (00:02)

Listen.

Renee (00:31)

Maybe. But yeah, Mara, if you could dive in to this first request, I'm so excited to talk about it.

Mara DeMauro (00:38)

Yeah, for sure. I was even thinking like, man, we could potentially be setting ourselves up for just some major heat. So, you know, because I think it can be controversial, which is just interesting in itself. It's like, we don't, you know, just this is fluid y'all. let people identify how they like to identify and, around this topic. ⁓ if it's all, you know, what we're here for is about supporting people through the journey.

We don't really care how you label it, but we're gonna break down today the different topics, the, sorry, different categories of sobriety. So we got a request, ⁓ and I'm gonna read it from my phone here.

Yeah. She said, I don't know if talking about drugs is outside of y'all's vision, but just like California sober, LOL. Like someone I looked up to, I was told was 20 years sober, then found out he's Cali sober, AKA smokes weed and does shrooms pretty much of the earth is Cali sober, LOL. But.

could be a fun topic, just like, what is Cali sober, et cetera.

but also not a bad thing. Like for some people, weed is better than alcohol, et cetera. It's all just gray area. So, and they also acknowledge that it could be a wormhole. And yeah, we agree. But yeah, this is such a fun, interesting topic because yeah, we're all just kind of like, hold on. We've heard different terms before, like Cali sober, sober curious, sober sober, ⁓ mindful drinking, you know.

Renee (02:02)

It is.

Mara DeMauro (02:19)

All of those things. So we're going to kind of break down the different topics and hopefully this is, this can be a resource to maybe help you figure out where you fit in or where you want to fit into and ⁓ how to, how to get there. So yeah, gray area.

Renee (02:38)

Yeah, what's the first one Mara? Gray area?

Yeah. So gray area. mean, I feel like I can maybe resonate with this one the most because that's where I was. This is kind of like, or how we categorize it, just sort of the beginning stages of maybe understanding or wanting to maybe find more information. Like you're kind of like on the cusp of making that next decision. So you're kind of like,

I feel like there's something here, but I'm not really sure. Is it that I have a problem? No. Okay, so maybe there is just something there. So I feel like you know that there is something there, but you can't really put your finger on it. But you're starting that process of getting the wheels turning of like, hmm, maybe there's something here and maybe I should be doing something about it.

Mara DeMauro (03:37)

Yeah, exactly. Um, to my understanding, it's sort of, you know, you're not in a place where you've hit rock bottom and you're kind of in the contemplate contemplation stage. There's uncertainty, but you're starting to reflect like, okay, I know my life isn't, you know, in shambles right now because I am consuming alcohol or other substances. But I also know like there's a little voice that's like, this probably isn't doing, you know, helping you to get.

where you want to go. So it's that first layer of contemplation, I agree.

Renee (04:08)

Yeah.

Yeah, and I think too, it could also be where you're at. It's like the identifier under subcategory or something. There's so many categories, but if you see yourself as like, I'm kind of only a social drinker or, I'm only ⁓ drinking when I do such and such. I feel like that's probably around the same lines of gray area.

Mara DeMauro (04:37)

Yeah. But I think we'll get into mindful drinking and that's where people have boundaries around when they choose to drink, which is like, only drink so so quote unquote socially, or, you know, I only drink on special occasions, but that often times is something that those decisions are made through the process of giving yourself space to actually

Renee (04:46)

Mm, right.

Mara DeMauro (05:06)

define what you want the boundaries to be. It's more mindful. It's not just an assumption that, yeah, I drink only like social settings. I only drink, da da. Like, did you actually give yourself the space and time to actually be truthful about when and how much and all of that? ⁓ I also kind of want to, I also wanted to backtrack and just say like,

Renee (05:25)

Yeah, maybe I got ahead of myself.

Mara DeMauro (05:31)

we're not at all giving medical advice regarding this. We're just talking about the different categories that we have seen and work through with our clients, even with ourselves, ⁓ just sharing that as knowledge. The second category that you may hear quite often is sober curiosity.

That is the realm that we really like to dance in because it's inviting people into a stage of exploration, a stage of mindfulness, and it's really lifestyle driven. So, and that could be for many different reasons. Maybe it's ⁓ wellness, you know, maybe it's a spiritual quest, maybe, you know, maybe it has to do with your career goals.

It could be anything around just wanting your, you know, you're looking at your lifestyle and you are seeing that there's opportunity for growth in your life and, and you're open to exploring how alcohol or other substances may be hindering you from that process. So there's that mindfulness approach, that exploration, that playful side of it. And it's open literally to anyone who's just curious. What do think?

Renee (06:57)

Yeah, I think

it's a natural progression from that sort of murky area where you're trying to understand or make sense of the feelings that you might be feeling in that gray area. to me, sober curiosity is sort of taking that first step into what that means for you, what actions you need to take, that introspective peeling of the onion, peeling of the layers to kind of get to

that more of like root and grounded foundation of like trying to understand your behaviors. And that's where, as you said, the exploration, the introspective ⁓ nature, ⁓ and just kind of playing around with it and having fun and trying to determine what's going to work best for you.

Mara DeMauro (07:46)

Yeah, totally. And then I feel like from here, there's kind of a couple different ways people decide to go ⁓ through the sober curious phase. We highly encourage that people give themselves a true break in space from alcohol to really determine what they want their relationship with alcohol to be. Whether that becomes the more mindful drinking, the one that has more boundaries in place.

Because they have given themselves the space and time away from it to distinguish what that is for them and you know, what feels good for them. Or some people are like, wow, I absolutely love my life so much better without this substance period. So I'm going to remain alcohol free by choice. and yeah, so that's interesting. So, you know, we, some people go to alcohol free route and then some people step into the more mindful drinking.

category.

Renee (08:44)

Yeah. And that, guess that's where I was saying I kind of got ahead of myself. And this is sort of the stage that it's like, okay, you know, I've had some time and space to really understand how my body feels physically, how my mind feels without having any kind of substance at all. Kind of, they say it when you're working out and stuff too, when you're starting that kind of programming, it's like...

You have to have or find your baseline and what your body needs, how your body feels without it. So it's like you've kind of done a lot of that prep work, getting into the nitty gritty of the work itself. And so now I feel like it's stepping into that next phase of like, okay, this is what's going to feel best for me. You know, maybe it's like, okay, I'm not drinking so much on the weekends. I know for a fact, like I don't have

an alcoholic drink is my first drink, so that way you're doing more zebra striping is what they call it, every alcoholic drink you have a non-alcoholic drink, all these different little things that really set you up to automatically drink less because you want to drink less. So just, I think, going into these situations where you are...

intentionally making decisions to ensure that you aren't drinking as much as you were in the past.

Mara DeMauro (10:07)

Yeah, that intentionality piece for sure. Keeney is just in the background here chirping along to our conversation. He must agree. Yeah, Scott.

Renee (10:15)

Our mascot is here.

Mara DeMauro (10:20)

⁓ I think too that there can be some confusion in.

You know, when you're in that gray area, like to, really check in. Cause I think a lot of people, including myself, when I was, you know, in that space, probably I'm just like, yeah, I barely drink. Like we always, you know, like, yeah, I barely eat a lot of chocolate. You're right. Like if I actually look at the situation, you know, like, ⁓ I'll probably be surprised about how much chocolate I eat.

But, you know, so that's just kind of an invitation. If you notice that that's kind of your first reaction, like, no, no, no. You know? OK, cool. If you're like totally fine with everything, then fine. Whatever. Do you. You know? But if you're actually here and you are trying to become more mindful, allow yourself to just like explore that, like soften there a little bit and explore how often it actually is and like what's the reasoning behind it, you know? So.

Renee (11:07)

Yeah.

Dude, I mean, you are preaching to the choir with that because when I started tracking how much I actually was drinking, whoo, yep, it was like 15 to 20 drinks a week. Like, and it's probably honestly more than that because at that point I was tracking and I was like, ⁓ God, I need to dial this back a little bit. ⁓ So yeah, I mean, maybe that's a challenge that you can.

Mara DeMauro (11:23)

you

Renee (11:51)

take away from this is like make those tick marks, get a calendar out, piece of paper. I know there's so many different apps out there, like I use Sunnyside, ⁓ but there's so many different apps out there where it's not so much about, and if you do want to track just like your days in general, that's good too, that's a good tool, but ⁓ just to kind of see how many drinks that you are imbibing in a day, just to kind of understand the reality of it.

Mara DeMauro (12:19)

Yeah, totally. And then we have ⁓ another category, which I think most people are most familiar with, which is the recovery ⁓ sober space. know, typically like through a 12 step program or AA, or there's so many other recovery programs out there now, which is amazing. ⁓ But typically that's like you're in a situation where you're hitting rock bottom. There's no room, space or time.

for you to be consuming substances because it could be your life is on the line, someone else's life's online. It's just not, ⁓ yeah, it's not an exploration. It's not really about that. It's like, yeah, we're doing this. ⁓ And yeah, we're so grateful that there are the resources out there. But Renee and I mostly.

Like our expertise is in the sober curious realm. ⁓ folks who can explore, and want to explore their relationship and redefine it. and then nay, you, ⁓ you found this one, which was, it's fun because it's like, it's so punk, ⁓ but straight edge, ⁓ from the eighties. So tell us a little bit about this.

Renee (13:37)

Yeah.

Yeah, straight edge.

Yeah, so when I think about this too, that was actually my first, first, first introduction to any kind of label or identity that had to do with drugs and alcohol, like removing that from your life. Because in high school, just like give you a little background and go down memory lane here, my

my friend group as of now, like we've been friends since high school. My husband was in the same friend group and they're in like a hardcore band and they were all straight edge. And I was like, what the fuck is straight edge? And yeah, it's this premise of like almost defiance and it's linked and layered in with ⁓ punk music. And it was back in the 80s and it's all about reclaiming

the identity against social norms. So like really pushing the boundary of like, we are so clear and into music and going against the grain. And it's for all of those kids who are in that punk scene that were, you know, the outcasts and the peons and all that shit. And so it was their way to kind of claim how I think they were viewed by the public.

Mara DeMauro (14:43)

Mm-hmm.

Renee (15:09)

to kind of throw it back in their face a little bit. ⁓ But yeah, it's just like ⁓ a different take on something that's of course has evolved into all these different types of identities, but it's a more punk one. So I kind of like it. Plus it's just like nostalgia for me.

Mara DeMauro (15:24)

Yeah, I love it. Yeah,

for sure. think it's so fun and just such a fun, yeah, it's fun concept. ⁓

Renee (15:34)

And there's

still bands, like there's still hardcore bands. They're still like it's straight edge is still, ⁓ I think. Yeah. Yeah. X, X, X.

Mara DeMauro (15:41)

A thing. Yeah. Forever live straight edge. ⁓ yeah,

yeah. And, know, something we were talking about earlier before we jumped on is like,

You know, we support all of this, like all the different categories that someone might feel like they fit into. And we recognize that our brains want to be able to categorize things and understand and like, okay, so, you know, I'm this or I'm that, you know, but to also just kind of like, at the end of the day, we...

Like our message is like, it just shouldn't be a big deal. Like whether or not you choose to drink or if you're dry ish, you know, or whether or not you want to use any of this terminology, like it just shouldn't be a big deal. um, so don't get too caught up in, am I, I don't even think we talked about Cali sober, which is funny. Yes. Oh my gosh. I'm like, hold on, wait a minute.

Renee (16:45)

No, we gotta talk about cat, which is like the original request.

Mara DeMauro (16:53)

⁓ But yeah, this, ⁓ you know, getting too stuck in, ⁓ I identify with this and I identify with that. It's like, at the end of the day, it's just a concept and a conversation around all of this.

Renee (17:07)

Well, I think it's hard to cause or like to just sometimes, or I guess I understand why, like you said, there is a, um, a whole like physical aspect to our brains wanting to categorize cause it makes it easier. It removes the decisions, all that kind of stuff. Um, but I also put it back to your value system. Cause for me, one of my values is like honesty and integrity.

And it's like, if I sit here and tell someone that I'm a sober curious coach, they already have this kind of notion of like, okay, well, you probably don't drink. And if I sit here and say that I'm a dry, like I have to say that I'm dry ish. I have to put the dry or the ish at the end so that they know that I still drink when in reality, it's like, okay, we go six months or I go six months or like long periods of time without drinking and then we'll maybe have one. I don't

and shouldn't have to explain that to somebody, but I internally feel like I'm doing myself the disservice of not being honest when in reality it's just like nobody fucking cares. It's like, dude, you just don't really drink. Like, okay, great, that's it.

Mara DeMauro (18:20)

Yeah, yeah.

Right.

I know it's like, wish it was just like that simple, but it's true because if you're having a conversation with someone who is contemplating redefining their relationship with alcohol and you're like, yeah, I'm a sober coach. You know, what, what could come up for them immediately? It was like, shoot. Like then I, this person, like their, their view was like, you should be sober, even if that's not true, you know? And so if you say, I'm a sober curious coach, they're kind of like, okay, this person's like,

Renee (18:46)

Right? Right.

Mara DeMauro (18:51)

probably definitely sober, but they're like curious? Like what does that mean? And then if you say I'm dry-ish, they're like, ⁓ okay, so they're dry most of the time-ish. There's like this little bit of, so it feels more like this person's gonna be more chill and open to having a conversation potentially, you know? And so it's, I get it, but also it's just kind of frustrating sometimes. like, my gosh.

Renee (18:55)

Mm.

Yeah, it's like, I have

to sit here and like explain to you, which I will gladly, but yeah, sometimes I, it is easier to, which I don't do this, but like, if you do decide to become sober, that is a part of it too, that you're able to just say, I'm sober, which equals you don't drink, or at least in my mind, yeah.

Mara DeMauro (19:32)

Mm-hmm. Right.

Right. ⁓ OK, let's talk about polysophere. ⁓ So, yeah, this is more so about no alcohol or hard drugs, but you occasionally, or I guess it's up to the person how often, ⁓ you're using cannabis or psychedelics. ⁓ Yeah, like

Renee (19:38)

Cali sober.

Mara DeMauro (20:01)

And it's like conscious consumption. I put quotation marks around that, ⁓ just cause whatever, know, like that's what's conscious to me is not conscious of someone else. Right. So, ⁓ but yeah, that's it's more so about like no alcohol or hard drugs. And I think like, I'm just like trying to think of what the next kind of step is. Like if you're like, okay, like.

Renee (20:03)

Mm.

Mara DeMauro (20:28)

We have all of these different categories now. Okay, like now what? You know? ⁓ And I would say like, well, that's kind of up to you. You know, like you have some things to kind of like ponder over. And then if you're like, yeah, you know what, kind of am in a space where I'd like to redefine what my relationship is with substances because of how, you know, I want my lifestyle to be. ⁓

That's why we're here. You know, we have a whole self led course that walks you through the same process we went through and many of our clients. So that's like an awesome resource that it's really fun.

Renee (21:08)

Yeah.

Yeah, I mean, that's our whole sort of premise and mission is this is what we're here for is to help you understand kind of where you're at and how to navigate and take the next steps into whatever that looks like for you. you know, hopefully it's it's obviously to ⁓

improve your lifestyle overall, like whatever that looks like for you. But that's what makes us so excited about how we can be there to support you as a resource, to talk about it, to talk through it. Because sometimes you just need somebody to talk through a lot of these things, ⁓ you know, through our experiences and then obviously working with clients too. And it reminds me of the conversation that we had during our SIP happens.

workshop that we just had recently with LaunchBreak. there was a question, well, two things that come to mind. One, you know, she, and this is one of the founders of LaunchBreak, which is ⁓ a networking platform for women athletes. And she asked, or was very excited about the workshop because she was like, yes, now I can understand how to talk about this subject correctly, which

Mara DeMauro (22:33)

Hmm.

Renee (22:34)

I

was like, this is the whole point. There's not really a right or wrong way to talk about it. You know, it's like all we just have to talk. So that was one piece of it. And then she also asked a question that was like, what do you guys think about essentially the Cali sober aspect of this? Like, does that fall into this category? What do you think about it? And yeah, I mean, of course it falls under the umbrella of, of all of this because

Mara DeMauro (22:39)

We just gotta start talking.

Renee (23:02)

It's you taking the steps to understand what's going to work best for you where you are no longer numbing things that are uncomfortable.

Mara DeMauro (23:15)

Yeah. Yeah. And I also feel like

I'm like, who am I to tell anyone else what their relationship with substances should be? I think I've been in a place where I definitely have done that. And of course, I'm like, yeah, if I visibly see someone in pain because of their actions or whatever, of course, I'm going to think I know what's right. And also, like,

Renee (23:32)

Mm.

Yeah.

Mara DeMauro (23:50)

I don't always know what's right for someone. ⁓ and that's what, that's what this whole conversation is about this movement. It, it, it gives you the opportunity to reclaim your power, to decide what you want to do with something that has just been the norm. ⁓ we just drink, you know, to celebrate because that's what we're told to do. we just drink to cope when we had a shitty day because that's what my dad did. we just, you know, like, hold on, let's just pause for a second.

can pause and you decide whether or not that's actually what you want to do. But a lot of times it requires a little bit more space than you probably think, you know, to give yourself the opportunity to truly like feel what's right for you. ⁓ And that can be challenging. And that's why we're here, is to guide people through that. ⁓ I also received a message on some posting.

Renee (24:29)

Yeah.

Mara DeMauro (24:49)

that I put the other day and, and this woman responded and she was like, cause I was talking about nose dive. ⁓ and she's like, can I ask an honest question? Why is it called sober curiosity and not just sober? Are people that afraid of the truth that not everyone needs to, or wants to drink to have a good time? Seems sad in a way.

Renee (25:11)

You

Mara DeMauro (25:12)

And I

thought that was like, I was like, I love questions like this because it, it isn't always so obvious. Like, yeah, the, the real truth is like, ⁓ you know, it's, it's sober curiosity is about a broader conversation and it's more inviting to everyone, not just someone who wants to be abstinent from every substance.

Renee (25:36)

Mm.

Mara DeMauro (25:41)

You know, that, that everyone can benefit from whether it's pulling away totally or just consuming less. That's it.

Renee (25:42)

Yeah.

Yeah, there's a bigger picture here. It's, yes, of course, we are talking specifically about drinking culture and alcohol, but there's such a bigger umbrella that this falls under of wellness and lifestyle and mind-body connection and emotional resiliency. There's just so much more that goes into it. ⁓

I think it is hard for people to be brutally honest with themselves to kind of turn that leaf and, and really dive deep into stuff that they've been burying with all different types of numbing things, whether that's social media or food or, you know, whatever it is. And nobody wants to get to that shadow of themselves or their ego or, you know, all those like uncomfortable.

So that's why we're here is we want to talk about it, get it out in the open, take some of that shame away from it, that guilt, ⁓ to not hide in a corner and be like, hey, you're not the only one feeling this way. And how can we help you get to the life that you want to create for yourself that's created by yourself? Yeah.

Mara DeMauro (27:12)

Yeah. Yeah. Totally

amazing. Do you have anything else on this topic?

Renee (27:16)

Yeah.

Hmm. I think too, it's like, just don't be afraid to say whatever the fuck you want. Like, you know, you don't have to fall in one of these areas. You don't have to say you're sober, curious. I think it's. I'm a unicorn. Like, yeah, you could say whatever the fuck you want. So I think it's like it's.

Mara DeMauro (27:36)

If someone asked you, you be like, I'm a unicorn. Like, you can say anything.

Renee (27:47)

empowering to be able to find your voice through this process. even if you don't really feel like you fall into any one of these categories, that's kind of like the point that we're getting at is it doesn't necessarily have to fall into one of those. But ⁓ on the flip side, if you are kind of like lost and don't really know, like it could be a good starting point to maybe start into one of those categories and then kind of blossom into.

whatever it is you feel is most comfortable.

Mara DeMauro (28:19)

Yeah, dive in, have fun.

Renee (28:20)

Yeah. Dive in. Yeah.

And I think too, what we'll put in the show notes is maybe some like resources for like, obviously we'll put our information. If you guys do decide you want to take that next step and start working with us through Nose Dive, we definitely have some resources there. ⁓ but we can put some other resources in there too. If you're looking more towards that, like recovery lifestyle or

just kind of these different categories. So we'll make sure to put some resources in there. And of course too, if this brings up anything or any other topics that you guys want to hear from us, we are Open Books. We love to dive into these deeper conversations on what you guys want to hear and how we can help support you through your journey.

Mara DeMauro (29:07)

Yeah, absolutely. Keep those requests coming in. That's so fun. And yeah, thanks for being here. And you can find us on the gram at nose dive co as well as tick tock. Right.

Renee (29:14)

Good Eve.

That's it.

TikToks too, yeah, it's the same. And YouTube. Y'all, yeah, dude. All right, man, till next time. Bye.

Mara DeMauro (29:25)

and YouTube cool yeah awesome see you next time bye ⁓